Dragonfly - a web framework for newLISP

[m35]

Hello @m35, but are you referring to me when you say "Fans of a certain web site that would humorously respond to weekly emails" ?!

Ah no sorry ale870. I was making a (perhaps too obscure) reference to a bit of internet culture/humor. cormullion seems to have picked up on it and provided an informative link. :)

(See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sbemail#Strong_Bad_Email">sbemail)

[ale870]

Sorry m35 for my misunderstanding!

[hilti]

Just a short notice: Dragonfly version 0.17 is out!



Dragonfly 0.17 provides some cool functions for auto-loading modules and custom helpers. Just put them into the specified directories "helpers-active" or "modules-active" and Dragonfly loads them on startup.



This way the Dragonfly web framework keeps small and efficient. You just load what You need.



Download it now and have fun!

http://code.google.com/p/dragonfly-newlisp/downloads/list">http://code.google.com/p/dragonfly-newl ... loads/list">http://code.google.com/p/dragonfly-newlisp/downloads/list



http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_CFrdlmy-B-I/SmrQGIPBE2I/AAAAAAAAAH0/Ece94VoTE74/s1600-h/Bild+3.png">

[ale870]

In these days I'm starting to work with Dojo framework, a language-independent AJAX client (one of the most famous). It is open source. See here:



http://www.dojotoolkit.org/">http://www.dojotoolkit.org/



Since it is language independent, it means it can be used even from newLisp...



So I think you could start to introduce such framework (or another one) instead producing pure html.

Dojo works in xml and json (and newLisp can do that very well).

I think in this way to could give a BIG improvement to your framework (and a lot of work  is done, since Dojo is stable and really well done!).

[newdep]

On itself those kits are nice like http://qooxdoo.org/">//http://qooxdoo.org/..

but a big disadvantgage I encountered is the speed and browser

compatibility...But they sure do have nice widgets ;-)

[ale870]

Try to use Dojo (check the demos). There is a delay on first usage (download javascript: about 130kb) but the system is really responsive.

[hilti]

Try to use Dojo (check the demos). There is a delay on first usage (download javascript: about 130kb) but the system is really responsive.

Hi Alessandro,



the Dojo Toolkit is really impressive. Although I like fancy AJAX-Stuff, drag & drop and those things I'm a bit aware of these bloated libraries. They're like MS Excel or Word where users just utilize 10% of the whole software.



Think about what users really need: isn't it a fast loading website, an interface/design which runs on mobiles like the iPhone too, content which is accessible by search engine bots.



If You try to load 130kb via Edge on a Mobile ... users will quit before they read Your first headline. And making things worse: most of the cool JS-Stuff won't really work in a touch environment like the iPhone.



cheers

Marc

[joejoe]

hi hilti - looks like really cool code you've released.



im curious to know why you chose the mit license instead of the license that newlisp uses, the gpl? any chance you might consider the gpl for future releases?



thanks in any case! - :0)

[TedWalther]

How about the two-clause BSD license?

[cormullion]

just out of interest, what's the difference between the suggested licences?

[xytroxon]

http://zedshaw.com/blog/2009-07-15.html">Is BSD The New GPL?



Note: Zed Shaw is the former Ruby language programming guru, now Python language advocate... Zed does not mince words over his opinionated views on programming, and does not suffer fools (or Rubists ;) lightly... That said, he is usually right... And now prefering GPL over BSD for his new works... But most people nowdays, that don't want to suffer the pains of trying to figure out (let alone try to strictly follow), either license's rules, just throw up their hands and use the MIT license, as the least painful license for simple works they wish to share... Of course that p*sses the GPL's Richard Stallman off to no end ;p)



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BSD_licenses">//http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BSD_licenses



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GNU_General_Public_License">//http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GNU_General_Public_License



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MIT_License">//http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MIT_License

[hilti]

But most people nowdays, that don't want to suffer the pains of trying to figure out (let alone try to strictly follow), either license's rules, just throw up their hands and use the MIT license, as the least painful license for simple works they wish to share...

That's why I use the MIT License.



What are the benefits when I use the GPL License for Dragonfly - are there any?

[TedWalther]

just out of interest, what's the difference between the suggested licences?

I think the modern two-clause BSD license is shortest and easiest to understand.

[xytroxon]

Here's an article, that for several possible advantages, such as for profit use, suggests the Apache License:

http://tech.yahoo.com/news/infoworld/20090810/tc_infoworld/85922">Does GPL still matter?

Jagielski claims that Apache's licensing terms are written to be comprehensible to people with no legal training. "It's very, very easy to read and understand, so it's a less risky license for external companies to use," he says.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apache_License">//http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apache_License

... as of July 2009, over 5000 non-ASF projects located at SourceForge.net are available under the terms of the Apache License.

The Apache Software Foundation and the Free Software Foundation (FSF) agree that the Apache License 2.0 is a free software licence, compatible with version 3 of the GNU General Public License (GPL).



However, the Free Software Foundation considers all versions of the Apache License (as of 2007) to be incompatible with the previous GPL versions 1 and 2.

-- xytroxon

[hilti]

... counting 37 downloads at Google Code :-)



I'm just wondering if anybody else uses Dragonfly for his projects? One project beside my own website is here: http://daycaster.org">//http://daycaster.org



Cheers

Hilti (working on version 0.20)